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Gral and Shran call a truce

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removing white from images

Thanks! Feel free to jump on as many as you can, less for me to do later :) --Alan 03:44, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

No problemo. I've taken care of all that I've seen you upload so far and will continue to do so throughout the night. --Morder 03:59, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

Main Cast Listings

I noticed you reverted a few of my edits this evening. I was just wondering why you thought it was necessary. I added a lot of these main cast listings myself a few months ago - most of the episodes did not have them until then. The only reason I started updating them again is because I just noticed it this way in the episode article for ENT: "Silent Enemy", which is nominated to be a featured article! I had actually added the main cast listing to that article back in March, but someone else added the ranks to it earlier this month. I agree it could be a little tricky during some episodes where the characters appear in flashbacks, but I figured that if this featured article had it this way we should standardize. Maybe you should change the main cast listing for that article and see if anyone complains! In any case, we should standardize on something, no?

Also, I like the idea of adding Tucker's nickname at least, because it is shown at way in some of the quotes. That is also the way his name is listed on the StarTrek.com site. I am going to go ahead and make only this change until we figure out the rest.

Frankly, your argument that the ranks appear in the character descriptions and so do not belong in the cast listing could be applied to their first names as well! — Greg (talk) 00:54, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

I understand your reasoning. Most of the episode pages for shows don't actually have the Main cast listing as they're already listed on the main page for the shows themselves. As such I think it's redundant enough to have them on each episode as it doesn't change (with very few exceptions). Of course, I could be wrong and will open this up for discussion on how best to standardize cast listings since there are too many discrepancies between the listings already. By the way, I had discussed it with two other members before I reverted your changes. So please don't take offense to it at all since I wouldn't do anything like that without getting a consensus. My way isn't the only way. :) --Morder

No offense taken! I started adding the main cast listings a while back when I saw them in a few episodes and thought it might be a good idea to standardize. It is kind of nice to have a place in the article to go to find a link to the character profile without having to type in the name or search through the article. The StarTrek.com episode pages list the main characters as well, though they do not list the ranks. But we do list the ranks for other characters, like Admiral Maxwell Forrest or Vulcan Ambassador Soval.

There is nothing wrong with redundancy, unless we are trying to save a few K of storage on the hard drive! LOL! — Greg (talk) 01:23, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

I think the reason for the Admiral Maxwell Forrest and such is simply because they're guest characters and as such their full names are then appropriate for those who haven't seen the episode. I hope others chime in on this discussion or maybe I should move it somewhere else first. --Morder 01:28, 23 May 2008 (UTC)
As an aside... credit listings should be as they were on screen. Not as they are on StarTrek.com, not as they are assumed to be. On screen is what counts. -- Sulfur 01:30, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

Agreed, for co-stars, listed at the end of the episode, but there are no names listed on screen for the main characters and guest stars! Also, Tucker is often referred to as "Trip" in the episodes, and even in the episode articles here.

Thanks for the civil discussion, BTW... it is refreshing! — Greg (talk) 01:45, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

Above all I hope we can be civil. I noticed you're reordering the guest stars alphabetically. Shouldn't it be in the order stated on the episode? --Morder 01:48, 23 May 2008 (UTC)
Just my two strips of latinum: I agree that there should be some standardization, particularly among the uncredited performers. On some pages, there's a subhead that says "Uncredited co-stars" followed by a list; on others, the uncredited are listed right after the credited co-stars with "(uncredited)" after their names. I prefer the former, and have tried to change it as often as I can. Ditto with the Stunt Doubles, who I also believe should be listed in their own subsection. Both sections should list those performers in alphabetical order as well. ThomasHL and I both have been making these edits for some time now, but I've been fairly random about them, adjusting when I happen to be making other edits to the pages.
As for the main cast, I personally wouldn't mind seeing them listed on each episode page. I find it highly annoying to have to search the Background section to figure out whether Cirroc Lofton was or wasn't in an episode. It's particularly bad on the Animated Series pages because right now, it's like trying to work a jigsaw puzzle to go through the Main Character non-appearances section and figure out who was and wasn't in each episode.
Regardless, though, Sulfur is correct that the listings for the credited performers should be as they were on screen, in the order they appeared on screen. If they have a name we can link to it (for example "Julie Cobb as Yeoman" with "Yeoman" linking to "Leslie Thompson"). I would be willing to write a set of guidelines based on what I've observed most users doing, if we think it would be beneficial to have something like that in our style manual. (There may already be such a section; I haven't looked for it.) - Bridge 01:52, 23 May 2008 (UTC)
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